Silk Road forums
Discussion => Drug safety => Topic started by: Rush Limbo on August 01, 2012, 09:50 pm
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Hi Gang! SO after a year of popping pills, mostly Hydrocodone I've decided to end this shit (At least for a while)! I've been doing pain meds mostly recreationally for the last year or so (though occasionally they do help with my back pain). Last several months between 2-4 pills a day, mostly 2 though. My last dose was yesterday at 8am, 2 pills (Lortab 10/500). Today the fatigue and body aches were HELL~!!!
Please tell me how long is this going to last? I don't want to live like this, I need pills to feel normal. If I'm not on it, I'm tired and aching and drained of energy. Standing up is a major fucking project!
How long before the worse physical symptoms are over?
Thanks!
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You should start feeling better in about 36 hours. The cravings and other psychological symptoms will take longer to subside, although it does help if you truly know it's time to quit. Benadryl is good for the itching, runny nose, and anything else histamine related. If food is going right through you, try Imodium (loperamide is itself an opiate that doesn't act on your brain). Sex and exercise do wonders to stimulate natural dopamine production once you feel better.
Good luck on your recovery! If all else fails, ride it out with some suboxone.
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You should start feeling better in about 36 hours. The cravings and other psychological symptoms will take longer to subside, although it does help if you truly know it's time to quit. Benadryl is good for the itching, runny nose, and anything else histamine related. If food is going right through you, try Imodium (loperamide is itself an opiate that doesn't act on your brain). Sex and exercise do wonders to stimulate natural dopamine production once you feel better.
Good luck on your recovery! If all else fails, ride it out with some suboxone.
my biggest problem is the muscle pain / aching. will that be over soon? and there's the sensitivity to touch too! my god my body feels like i'm bruised and tired EVERYWHERE. every movement and touch hurts! I hear Hydrocodone withdrawal is faster than other opiates, is it true?
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Look, I don't know much about opiates, but I do know about hallucinogens and cannabis. Research suggests that acid has great success in alcohol withdrawal and pain relief... While it does not make the pain go away, it makes you care about it less...
I suggest you try taking LSD and smoking cannabis for relief (for the duration of the detox). I don't know how effective something like that would be, but there's no harm in trying... Worst case you get addicted to cannabis which is not a big deal, and much better than being addicted to opiates (for various reasons).
Keep in mind that theoretically opiates don't cause health risks if they are taken in moderation, and are pure. However, there is a great risk for addiction (as you have discovered), and it's pretty easy to OD, and tolerance builds up quickly... All of those combined make opiates problematic.
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BTW, AFAIK you're not supposed to do it cold turkey, and doctors usually prescribe weaker opiates to help the detox period (or you take a smaller amount yourself)... That way you detox gradually.
Caffeine detox is done that way btw (1st day you drink half the amount you usually do, and each day half). However caffeine detox is obviously much easier, but it has some similarities, for instance in its addictiveness.
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I just remembered there are more evidence to support a slow withdrawal is easier than a quick one. There was some research done on what would be better - removing a bandage quickly or slowly. Here is an article about it:http://www.neatorama.com/2011/07/19/should-you-rip-a-bandage-off-slow-or-fast/, the research was published in the Medical Journal of Australia (so it's probably not bullshit), and the conclusion is that slowly ripping a band aid off got a pain result of 0.92 while doing it quickly got a pain score of 1.58, or in other words ripping it quickly would be almost twice as painful.
Not sure if its relevant for your case, but gradual detox is very popular today (one possible explanation to why people want to remove the band aid quickly btw, is that THEY don't like to see you in pain...)
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You can try OTC pain relievers like tylenol or naproxen (alleve) and a warm shower for the aches. I'm not sure if hydrocodone withdrawals are quicker, but I know they aren't drawn out like methadone and other opiods with a long half-life. Most of the symptoms, including aches and sensitivity, should be gone in about two more days. You were taking relatively small doses of one of the weaker opiates, so your withdrawals shouldn't get that much worse. Smoke some bud if you can, it definitely helps the nausea and restlessness. Just be careful not to smoke too much, as it can get rather unpleasant in amounts that would normally feel good.
I was taking 5mg percocets and/or 36mg tramadol every other day for a few months, followed by daily tramadol use for the last 2 weeks. Now I'm starting to run out and taper down. It's amazing how bad post-workout muscle soreness can be when your body is craving this shit lol. A year of use at a higher dose would much worse though. Withdrawal from heavy duty use like taking oxy 80s twice a day or banging H is unimaginable though.
Zustroid2, yeah, it's way easier to taper than it so to stop cold turkey. At higher doses and with shit like benzos, you pretty much have to taper. I think OP has already been clean for a day though, so it would be too late in this case.
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You can try OTC pain relievers like tylenol or naproxen (alleve) and a warm shower for the aches. I'm not sure if hydrocodone withdrawals are quicker, but I know they aren't drawn out like methadone and other opiods with a long half-life. Most of the symptoms, including aches and sensitivity, should be gone in about two more days. You were taking relatively small doses of one of the weaker opiates, so your withdrawals shouldn't get that much worse. Smoke some bud if you can, it definitely helps the nausea and restlessness. Just be careful not to smoke too much, as it can get rather unpleasant in amounts that would normally feel good.
I was taking 5mg percocets and/or 36mg tramadol every other day for a few months, followed by daily tramadol use for the last 2 weeks. Now I'm starting to run out and taper down. It's amazing how bad post-workout muscle soreness can be when your body is craving this shit lol. A year of use at a higher dose would much worse though. Withdrawal from heavy duty use like taking oxy 80s twice a day or banging H is unimaginable though.
Zustroid2, yeah, it's way easier to taper than it so to stop cold turkey. At higher doses and with shit like benzos, you pretty much have to taper. I think OP has already been clean for a day though, so it would be too late in this case.
it's been 36 hours since my last dose of 2 Lortabs 10/500. the muscle pain, chills, and aching are the worse today (my last dose was yesterday, Tuesday, morning at 8am). i'm hoping to feel fresh by Saturday morning... i do smoke weed, but lately wifey found out that i wanted to try Coke, and was super upset and worried that weed is my addiction so i promised to smoke less, and haven't had any in couple of days. so at this point it's vitamins (Centrum + B Complex) and Advil PM at night, Advil during day. I should try Aleve, I hear it works wonders...
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Benzos always help take the edge off . Get some vallies or something try keeping yourself busy, exercise is supposed to be good, releases endorphins and shit.
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You can try OTC pain relievers like tylenol or naproxen (alleve) and a warm shower for the aches. I'm not sure if hydrocodone withdrawals are quicker, but I know they aren't drawn out like methadone and other opiods with a long half-life. Most of the symptoms, including aches and sensitivity, should be gone in about two more days. You were taking relatively small doses of one of the weaker opiates, so your withdrawals shouldn't get that much worse. Smoke some bud if you can, it definitely helps the nausea and restlessness. Just be careful not to smoke too much, as it can get rather unpleasant in amounts that would normally feel good.
I was taking 5mg percocets and/or 36mg tramadol every other day for a few months, followed by daily tramadol use for the last 2 weeks. Now I'm starting to run out and taper down. It's amazing how bad post-workout muscle soreness can be when your body is craving this shit lol. A year of use at a higher dose would much worse though. Withdrawal from heavy duty use like taking oxy 80s twice a day or banging H is unimaginable though.
Zustroid2, yeah, it's way easier to taper than it so to stop cold turkey. At higher doses and with shit like benzos, you pretty much have to taper. I think OP has already been clean for a day though, so it would be too late in this case.
it's been 36 hours since my last dose of 2 Lortabs 10/500. the muscle pain, chills, and aching are the worse today (my last dose was yesterday, Tuesday, morning at 8am). i'm hoping to feel fresh by Saturday morning... i do smoke weed, but lately wifey found out that i wanted to try Coke, and was super upset and worried that weed is my addiction so i promised to smoke less, and haven't had any in couple of days. so at this point it's vitamins (Centrum + B Complex) and Advil PM at night, Advil during day. I should try Aleve, I hear it works wonders...
The physical withdrawals should be done by Saturday. I don't see why it would last longer than that. Sucks about your bud situation.. I know how that goes lol. Yeah, try some aleve and like the last post said some benzos like xanax or valium will make the time pass quicker if nothing else.
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You can try OTC pain relievers like tylenol or naproxen (alleve) and a warm shower for the aches. I'm not sure if hydrocodone withdrawals are quicker, but I know they aren't drawn out like methadone and other opiods with a long half-life. Most of the symptoms, including aches and sensitivity, should be gone in about two more days. You were taking relatively small doses of one of the weaker opiates, so your withdrawals shouldn't get that much worse. Smoke some bud if you can, it definitely helps the nausea and restlessness. Just be careful not to smoke too much, as it can get rather unpleasant in amounts that would normally feel good.
I was taking 5mg percocets and/or 36mg tramadol every other day for a few months, followed by daily tramadol use for the last 2 weeks. Now I'm starting to run out and taper down. It's amazing how bad post-workout muscle soreness can be when your body is craving this shit lol. A year of use at a higher dose would much worse though. Withdrawal from heavy duty use like taking oxy 80s twice a day or banging H is unimaginable though.
Zustroid2, yeah, it's way easier to taper than it so to stop cold turkey. At higher doses and with shit like benzos, you pretty much have to taper. I think OP has already been clean for a day though, so it would be too late in this case.
it's been 36 hours since my last dose of 2 Lortabs 10/500. the muscle pain, chills, and aching are the worse today (my last dose was yesterday, Tuesday, morning at 8am). i'm hoping to feel fresh by Saturday morning... i do smoke weed, but lately wifey found out that i wanted to try Coke, and was super upset and worried that weed is my addiction so i promised to smoke less, and haven't had any in couple of days. so at this point it's vitamins (Centrum + B Complex) and Advil PM at night, Advil during day. I should try Aleve, I hear it works wonders...
The physical withdrawals should be done by Saturday. I don't see why it would last longer than that. Sucks about your bud situation.. I know how that goes lol. Yeah, try some aleve and like the last post said some benzos like xanax or valium will make the time pass quicker if nothing else.
thanks! i hope to feel better by Saturday!
i'll post an update tomorrow morning, that will be 48 hours since last dose... i'm keeping one pill on hand to test my character, but I AM NOT taking it, it's more of a self inflicted test / torture... i'm weird like that.
can't be on benzos, gotta work and be around kids and wife. don't want to be out of it... i want to make sure i remember every second of it, so that next time i reach for a bottle of hydros or oxies i'll have a better idea of what i'm getting myself into... again, i'm weird like that...
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It's better to stay disciplined if you can and avoid the benzos, except maybe a short acting, low dose xanax at night. Keeping a few of your DOC on hand helps too, especially if you have crazy anxiety. You never know when you'll need them for pain anyway. Then again if you really love the feeling and uncontrollably crave opiates, it may be best to get rid of the pills or leave them with someone you trust in case you really need them.
Again, good luck and definitely keep us updated.
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im a little botherd now lol, i had a motocycle accident a few months ago and have been on 90mg oxy a day and will be for a good 18 months. So i will have to make sure the doctor gives me weaker tabs so i dont suffer this nastyness !!! I agree that i also think you should be smoking or eating weed and taking a small amount of benzos. I suppose one other thing to take into concideration would bee to eat well, with a high vitamin and mineral intake, also try and sleep as much as possible.
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^Look into suboxone when the time comes to quit. Your doc should have you covered, but if he doesn't mention it, either ask him or go to a doctor that is suboxone certified.
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48 hours update:
the night was fucking rough, i haven't slept AT ALL, and now I know what restless-whole-fucking-body-syndrome feel like!!! jesus i couldn't stop moving, twitching, turning, flexing muscles, bending arms, legs, fingers, and toes, not to mention sweating like a pig! i just got out of bed 3 minutes ago, and my back feels a bit stiff but otherwise no pain or aching so far, let's hope it stays this way! time to take some vitamins, advil, head to work!
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48 hours, 10 minutes update:
my nose is running like a river! oh, and i'm horny as hell, wtf!
p.s. did i mention i also quit smoking yesterday...
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Why did you come off so hard ?? my lord, after reading your experiences i dont understand why you didnt use a milder opiate to slowly wind down rather than stop completely. Dont get me wrong, i cant fault you for being a man and savaging it out, respect to you for that !! I hope all goes well matey and you must be over the worst of it by now. Keep it up, well done so far, you setting a good example for people :D
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I came off xanax cold turkey. I was under 18 when i did it. I moved back in with my mom and she decided that i didn't "need" xanax no more. I couldn't get my script filled without her signing. So i came off 10mg daily of xanax cold turkey.(Yes, that's five bars a day.) I can imagine your pain if it was anything like i went through. Sweats, chills, fatigue, and anger. The worst part of it was seizures. Those sucked! So, i'm proud of you for coming off, but if i wouldn't of recommended cold turkey. But, for some they feel they have to go cold turkey to test their strength. I got closer to god in that time, more than i have ever been in my life. I wish you the best of luck and please keep us updated. We're here for you.
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57 hours update:
day started off better then went to shit around 1pm. i loaded up on vitamins (Centrum for men under 50 and B Complex) in the morning, as well as 2 bottles of vitamin water and advil. Had to pop 2 Aleve's at 1pm cuz muscle and joint pain and aching was getting unbearable, Aleve helped. i notice that i feel much better when I'm moving, once I sit down it's game over, aka more pain/aching.
Question: I have some SOMA's left, will they help with restless leg syndrome at night? I'm thinking about combining 350mg SOMA and some Advil PM to get me through the night and maybe get some sleep; your thoughts? Also, when can I expect the muscle/joint aching to go away? And the total lack of energy and motivation is a fucking downer too, left work at 4pm today, couldn't stand it any longer...
Hopefully few more days and I'll break the iron fist'ed grip of the poppy! Not sure if I would ever started doing pills on daily basis if I knew what I would be going through right now... i though about tapering off slowly but I don't feel like calling doc, appointment, and all that bs, I'm almost 3 days into it so gonna try to tough it out.
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Did I mention my sex-drive is in high fucking gear?!?!? Hey, wifey will be happy tonight :-)
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One other thing: little but of Vodka takes the edge off...
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You are almost there, believe it or not. Try the soma, it should help with the restlessness and muscle aches. Vodka and benzos are actually quite similar, so if you're not a heavy drinker, a few shots won't hurt if that helps. The sex drive thing is about the only symptom I never experienced, then again I never took that high a dose for that long. I too will be staying off pills unless I need them once this supply runs out. Smoke bud if you have to, but daily opiate use is not worth it unless absolutely, 100% necessary.
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Keep up the good work Rush! Seems like your doin a good job man!
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You are almost there, believe it or not. Try the soma, it should help with the restlessness and muscle aches. Vodka and benzos are actually quite similar, so if you're not a heavy drinker, a few shots won't hurt if that helps. The sex drive thing is about the only symptom I never experienced, then again I never took that high a dose for that long. I too will be staying off pills unless I need them once this supply runs out. Smoke bud if you have to, but daily opiate use is not worth it unless absolutely, 100% necessary.
totally agreed on the everyday opiate use! jesus christ what a price you pay! so i took a SOMA around 5:30 and felt much better soon after, still irritable though but most pain and fatigue gone; put kids to bed and reminded my wife why she married me :-D
i'm about to pop a second SOMA and some Advil PM and call it a night! hopefully I'll get some decent sleep and will be in better shape tomorrow! BTW, I have a phone interview at 4:30pm tomorrow for a job I really want, so I sure as fuck picked a great time to do this!
I'll post an update tomorrow morning when I get up, hopefully rested and refreshed! btw, SOMA doesn't really mess with my head at all, so I think tomorrow morning I'll take some along with Aleve (the best OTC pain med so far for the symptoms). Hopefully in few more days it will all be behind me!
G'Nite Gang!
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Hi Gang! SO after a year of popping pills, mostly Hydrocodone I've decided to end this shit (At least for a while)! I've been doing pain meds mostly recreationally for the last year or so (though occasionally they do help with my back pain). Last several months between 2-4 pills a day, mostly 2 though. My last dose was yesterday at 8am, 2 pills (Lortab 10/500). Today the fatigue and body aches were HELL~!!!
Please tell me how long is this going to last? I don't want to live like this, I need pills to feel normal. If I'm not on it, I'm tired and aching and drained of energy. Standing up is a major fucking project!
How long before the worse physical symptoms are over?
Thanks!
Dude, cold turkey and don't look back. I had a 20-35 pill habit a day with the 10/325 pills. When the Internet was wide open for doctor phone consultations. I had pills up the gazoo. Take 6 in the morning, 6 at lunch, 6 at 3pm, then 6 again at night then a night cap of whatever. I did that for about 6 straight months never running out of pills. I became the most resourceful person in the world to get them and I did. When I hear people having 2-4 pills / day habit, that's not even a habit! That's what the doc ordered.
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I was addicted to weak opioid codeine. Physical withdrawals were weak and no problem, but at that moment i came over methadone (bought from SR), and not only i was high as fuck from it, it also helped me with withdrawals - i used methadone for like a week, and haven't used codeine 2 days before it. When methadone was all consumed, there was no sign of physical withdrawal. But even with hydrocodone it seems to be kinda extreme, and i don't recommend it - just sharing my experience.
Anyway, i think psychical addiction is what really dangerous. With all that medications we have access to, withdrawals can easily made manageable. But thoughts of that high, possibility to turn even the most shitty day to best day you ever had with just one pill that costs not that much - this shit is seriously dangerous and hard to drive away from your thoughts. Weed can help with it, as altered state of mind from any drug helps forget opiates. At least to me.
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I've heard subutex will eliminate withdrawals from opiates. It is available on SR, but do some research first as I can't personally confirm this I have only heard about it in the case of heroin addicts.
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5 days update:
yep, it's been exactly 5 days, 120 hours, since my last dose. the energy is coming back, the aches and pains are for the most part gone. the worse part is the insomnia! haven't slept in 4 nights... HELP!!!!!!! i've tried SOMA, Advil PM, Benadryl, Vodka, and a mix of all of the above. nothing works. WHEN WILL MY SLEEP RETURN TO ME!?!?!?!?!
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one other thing, it takes serious effort to get jump started in the morning, when i first get out of bed walking, breathing, and all physical activity takes a serious effort, like you're moving through mud. what i noticed helped with energy this morning was 2 eggos chocolate chip toasts with strawberry jam and whipped cream, together with centrum vitamin and some B-Compex. also some moving around, brisk walking, waving your arms, few sit ups make a HUGE difference with how you're going to feel for the rest of the day! so yea, exercise helps!
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oh yea, do not quick Cigarettes and Opiates at the same time; you will be quadrupling your misery :-P
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Yeah, unfortunately that made it much worse. The lingering insomnia and other mental symptoms could definitely be a result of nicotine withdrawal. I'm not sure what you can take (that isn't also addictive lol), though it should really be over within a few more days. 2 more days and it's a week, which makes sense because you quit smoking as well. For most people, it takes longer to withdraw off nicotine than painkillers.
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Yeah, unfortunately that made it much worse. The lingering insomnia and other mental symptoms could definitely be a result of nicotine withdrawal. I'm not sure what you can take (that isn't also addictive lol), though it should really be over within a few more days. 2 more days and it's a week, which makes sense because you quit smoking as well. For most people, it takes longer to withdraw off nicotine than painkillers.
i've actually been sneaking in few smokes a day as well as V2 Electronic Cig with full strength cartridges. I figured I can quit smoking later :-) Do you know how soon I can expect to get a full night sleep? Tonight I was kind of in and out of snoozing all night. Not really awake but not really asleep either; each hour felt like 10-15 minutes of just staring at the wall, tossing, turning, couldn't find a comfortable position, too hot, then too cold, I bet lack of sleep is why most people relapse! Also I noticed this almost constant feeling of unease; like I'm lost searching for some deep meaning in life or some shit like that; like no matter what I do or plan on doing I feel emptiness inside; I wonder if that has something to do with my dopamine levels having to regulate back to normal...
BTW, I still have 1 Lortab left, 10/500mg. I wonder if taking quarter of it at night would help me sleep? BUT WOULD IT CAUSE A RELAPSE OF PHYSICAL SYMPTOMS??? I really am not planning on going back to doing this shit everyday, but the insomnia is killing me, would taking 2.5mg of hydro at night to help me sleep cause a return of pains and aches the next day? If yes then fuck it I'm not taking it, but I just wonder if it would be dangerous at this stage, or should I just tough it out few more days? I NEED MY SLEEP BACK!!!
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You got yourself in the shituation, now you gotta get yourself out. First of all, make sure good diet and exercise are a part of your daily routine. THis will help ease physical withdrawl symptoms, lack of sleep, bowel issues, etc. Secondly, get rid of that last pill you have, no need hanging onto the demons when you're trying to rid yourself of them. Last,y, hang in there, 3 days of hell will begin your liberation.
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You got yourself in the shituation, now you gotta get yourself out. First of all, make sure good diet and exercise are a part of your daily routine. THis will help ease physical withdrawl symptoms, lack of sleep, bowel issues, etc. Secondly, get rid of that last pill you have, no need hanging onto the demons when you're trying to rid yourself of them. Last,y, hang in there, 3 days of hell will begin your liberation.
bootl3gg3r,
been exercising and eating well! i got a pool so i'm in it everyday swimming and playing with kids! the last pill stays, it's my self inflicted test of character :-) was just wondering if it could actually help with withdrawals or not...
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If you can get your hand on some xanax or valium that would help a lot with you withdrawl symptoms
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Yeah get some benzos just for sleep. Dipphenhydramine works as well.
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I sure hope the 30 to 90 minute bursts of depression are a withdrawal symptom!!!
I just swam in my pool for 30 minutes and I feel much better, physically and mentally...... this sucks so fucking bad.......
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Look, I don't know much about opiates, but I do know about hallucinogens and cannabis. Research suggests that acid has great success in alcohol withdrawal and pain relief... While it does not make the pain go away, it makes you care about it less...
I suggest you try taking LSD and smoking cannabis for relief (for the duration of the detox). I don't know how effective something like that would be, but there's no harm in trying... Worst case you get addicted to cannabis which is not a big deal, and much better than being addicted to opiates (for various reasons).
Keep in mind that theoretically opiates don't cause health risks if they are taken in moderation, and are pure. However, there is a great risk for addiction (as you have discovered), and it's pretty easy to OD, and tolerance builds up quickly... All of those combined make opiates problematic.
PLEASE nobody take LSD whilst in opiate withdrawal, that's a bad idea.
If you don't know what your taking about then don't offer any advice. ::)
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Hi, hope you are feeling better by now, thought I would share some tips that have always done me well as I have come off and on many times in the years with opiates. Some of these may have been mentioned already.
Exercise. By far the last thing you feel like doing, but if you make yourself start to, you will feel so much better.
For meds, clonidine was prescribed to me by a doc for withdrawal symptoms and helped a ton. Over the counter he told me to buy Immodium. Apparently the drug in Immodium is also an opiate family member but only affects your gastro-intestinal system and does not cross the blood-brain barrier, so although it doesn't get you high, it will go to the opiate receptors in your guts (yes you have them there too which is why you may have diarrhea/upset stomach) and help to calm them.
Although suboxone/subutex is a viable option for heavy opiate addiction, I would not recommend it for you as they are still opiates and able to be addicted to. They are usually an option for people with heavier opiate use like oxycodone/oxymorphone/hydromorphone/heroin/etc (not trying to downgrade yours). The sub doc I go to says sub is severely overly prescribed to people who really didn't need it and end up being more addicted. I am on them now, and although the withdrawal from them is less severe than with full-agonist opiates, it is still there and still uncomfortable.
Really hot baths/hot tubs always help with the muscle aches.
Hope that helps!
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hang in there, and DO NOT get a benzo. much much more addictive than the hydrocodone you're trying to kick.
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hang in there, and DO NOT get a benzo. much much more addictive than the hydrocodone you're trying to kick.
I've been through benzo addiction and I understand it's tough however I think in this circumstance it could be useful. I found that there was very little psychological craving with benzos and majority of it was physical. Somehow you find yourself addicted before you realise, through habit rather than desire. I would still advise to use with caution, but for a short withdrawal they could help with the insomnia and the mental issues. Just keep the dose low.
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hang in there, and DO NOT get a benzo. much much more addictive than the hydrocodone you're trying to kick.
I've been through benzo addiction and I understand it's tough however I think in this circumstance it could be useful. I found that there was very little psychological craving with benzos and majority of it was physical. Somehow you find yourself addicted before you realise, through habit rather than desire. I would still advise to use with caution, but for a short withdrawal they could help with the insomnia and the mental issues. Just keep the dose low.
Yeah, benzos can be a slippery slope, I can't tell you how many times I've had a ziploc bag full of bars ony to find months of my life missing sometime later. It's fucked when you have abundant amounts of them on hand with no will power.
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Many many good bits of advice on here.
Done these kind of WD's too many times in a previous life. Some bullet points and my two peneth worth:
* Exercise. Keep doing it. Why? Endomorphine production. The aerobic high might feel weak at first, but keep at it. You need to become dependent on your own natural morphine again.
* The depressive cycles will fade over time.
* My constant running for to the toilet ended after a month. I keep Loperimide / Imodium on me always now.
* Constant leg and arm movements were the biggest grievance for me. I used Etizolam in the acute phases, a short acting Xanax like thienodiazapine. Cannabis, both natural and synthetic, helped beyond that, though the AM2201 seriously kicked the shit out of me afterwards.
* I still suffer from insomnia and my last opiate addition spell of three years ended just over a year ago. Practicing mediation helps, as I then get the rest my brain and body needs, even if I don't sleep normally.
* My temperature is still screwed. I get hot and cold flashes, though they are far less than what they used to be. Just go with it, as annoying as they are. Anti-antiperspirant can help, but they block your pours. Use kitchen towel, and have a can of deodorant on hand along with a change of shirt for work.
* Whilst I totally recommend lots of fresh fruit, veg, whole and living foods, give your body's endorphins a kick and munch on some mature cheese and hot chilli toasties or similar. Triggers those lovely natural chemicals.
* Read up about PAWS - post acute withdrawal syndrome. Most opiate heads can do the first part of the withdrawal, even if their fear convinces them otherwise. It is the PAWS that is the danger, if you are serious about staying off them. This is the craving that strikes out of nowhere, usually from some random psychological trigger and usually when you are knackered, stressed and generally vulnerable. Read up on it, as your doctor probably knows jack shit about it.
A fucking big WELL DONE to you for making this decision.
Chuck away your last pill. Regardless of what reason you are giving yourself for hanging on to it, you can disprove that reason in a moment by chucking it in the trash and then observing your immediate and honest emotional reaction.
If you react like 99% of those who hang on to them do, you'll panic... Then realise you were hanging on to it because of fear. Well done on throwing it away.
And if you are the 1% of those who don't react like that... An even BIGGER WELL DONE. You really didn't need it.
Put it this way.
If you were hell bent in shooting yourself in the head to commit suicide, why would you keep the hollow point round that you were going to use to do the job?
You are right. It is torturous. Since torture is a symbol of an uncivilised society, be civilised to yourself and chuck it. Watch your emotional reaction as you do so.
Opiate addiction...
That white bitch will do everything in her power to make you hang on to her keys... Just in case you need to pop round. For any reason. Whether that is because you have a crisis or just feel like a social call. Just in case, y'know... Or even just hang on to them to remind you of how far you have come or to prove that you are strong enough without her.
Quite frankly, she doesn't give a fuck why you have them, as long as you have them. Give her the finger instead.
/HUGEsalute
**All the above is IMHO and your mileage may vary.
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hey just wanted to chime in on this.. I'm in a methadone maintenance program, (though i wouldnt recommend nothing like that to you), and i have struggled with addiction for about 10 years now. I think cold turkey is pretty much the only way to go for a 20mg a day hydrocodone habit, so congrats on going that route man. Like someone else said, suboxone is pointless, its for someone with a larger addiction, and would just be trading one thing for another. It seems as though if youve made it this far, you've made it through most of the worst stuff. It ends up going uphill eventually man, just keep your head up. Also, battle one enemy at a time man.. trying to quit smoking at the same time is putting yourself at an unfair disadvantage. I think it would be best for you to just stay away from sugary drinks and foods to help keep your caffeine intake low (for sleep), and just stick to OTC remedies for symptoms. also, previous posts have good info in them too, i just figured i wouldn't reiterate them in my post.
If you do find yourself back on the vicodin, just set up a schedule for yourself to wean off of it...do 20mgs for 4 days, then do 15 for 5 or 6, then when your ready goto 10 then 5.. you can also buy 5mg hydros if you want to wean even slower by cutting them in half (20,17.5,15,12.5,10,7.5,5,2.5...FREEDOM!!)
no matter what you do man, good luck, and remember your not alone, you can always come to this community for help, and if not, im here to talk to...im in the same boat brother
trainfour20
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today was strange... i woke up (not really slept much) with absolutely zero energy, drained like a horse after a western film, went to work, had breakfast, then lunch; finally around 1pm i took a 30 minute walk and afterwards started reading some positive news etc and my mood improved, and immediately my body improved as well, almost within minutes my energy was back, not all of it, but a lot! got home around 6pm, dinner, bathing kids, shower, wife... twice :-D, now I took some Unisom and am about to pop some Melatonim tablets as well... i think at this point it's the stress or just emotions of all this that are keeping me awake every night. i really hope to get some sleep tonight!!! last few days after getting some exercise and a good meal i feel absolutely awesome! and then there are parts of the same day where i'm depressed and tired as hell! and it usually starts bad, and gets better in the afternoon :-/
i've also loaded up on vitamins, vitamin water, B-Complex, L-Tyrosin (will try that tomorrow morning before breakfast, i'll take it with B-Complex and chase it with Emergen-C, i hear it really gives you a jump start on the day) i'm eating fine and exercising every day! tomorrow morning if it's not raining too much i'll jump in the pool for 10-20 minutes to stretch my muscles and swim, hopefully that will get my body pumped up and i'll be energized for the rest of the day!
will report back tomorrow...
g'nite gang, and thanks for all the support!
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holly shit i slept! took some unisom and some other sleeping thingie, then i remember tossing and turning a bit, then.... i DO NOT remember my wife coming to bed, then my kid woke us up in the early am, 4 or 5, since then i was just snoozing, but shit, at least i slept some!!!
i also just got out of the pool, swam about 20 or so lengths of it. shower time, breakfast, and off to work i go! will report in the evening...
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Awesome! Glad to hear that you are almost past the acute phase of withdrawal. Some awesome words from chemdog as well; thanks for the informative and inspirational post! You reminded about PAWS and a few other things I forgot to mention. Damn, I better start weaning off that tramadol while I'm still at half a 50mg pill a day.
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good for you man, hope it keeps getting easier. Give yourself a while of sobriety before trying to shake them cigarettes too, they might be a life saver in a desperate time! lol.... keeps us posted on how things go for you man. Good luck! :)
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Definitely don't even think about quitting smoking for the time being.
I've quit morphine a few times (mostly to clean out my tolerance and to remind myself that I actually could survive without it, never attempted it for keeps) and the biggest issue that is going to come up for you in the next few days and weeks is not knowing what to do with yourself. I always got real fidgety and having a cigarette in my hand always helped to deal with that. If you are sitting around and tapping your feet and wiggling your fingers then light up. At least it gives you something to focus on.
You're also going to have a lot more energy than you are used to, which makes it feel like you have ADD or something. People say exercise is the best way to deal with that, although it can be hard to find a continuous period to exercise in if your life is busy.
Failing that, try to really dive into things that you know will tire you out. You said you have kids, so I'm sure that they will be happy to keep you busy for just as long as you can keep up with them. Same goes for your other half, really DO stuff. Throw yourself into your relationship like you were a teenager. Go places, do things, talk all night long. Keep your mind and body active and don't give yourself the chance to be stuck doing nothing. When I was driving, I started singing in the car, which also really helped. It took me from chain smoking and swearing at the guy in front of me to just driving normally. If you get trains or buses, take sudoku or something active to do to keep your fingers busy.
Chances are you won't be able to easily sleep sometimes for the next couple of weeks at least, no matter how tired you feel. If you feel ok about having drugs in the house, then Valium or similar benxos will be a real friend here and stop you turning into a zombie. I found a couple of times after I had got into a pattern of staying busy all day, if I couldn't sleep for one or two nights that I wouldn't be able to do anything the next day and suddenly instead of doing all the good stuff to keep me active all I could do was mope around and feel like my whole life had failed. So anything you can do that will help you sleep would be helpful. If you can't trust yourself, suggest that your wife keeps hold of the pills. Even if she doesn't know about your opiate addiction, she must know that you haven't been sleeping, and its easy enough to say 'I need to sleep, but it so easy to depend on them' and she'll probably help you out.
Above all, stay strong. Make a card with the reasons that you quit on it and carry it everywhere. If ever you are tempted to use, get it out and really think about those reasons. You know why you quit, you know why you don't want to use, and now you're over the hump you can beat back the cravings by reminding yourself why you went through that hell. It's a mantra to keep away the evil spirits, and if you're anything like me you'll have days where you'll spend half the time repeating it over and over. I always found it to be a comfort. Any reasons that were strong enough for you to go through what you did without breaking will be strong enough to take you forward from now.
And of course, talk about it. Even just typing here helps. Giving form to what you are feeling pushes it out of your brain. A problem shared is a problem halved, and thats so true for drug cravings. Most importantly, whoever you talk to is going to tell you that its ok to feel like drugs mean more to you than your wife or kids. Because sometimes it really does feel like that, but beating yourself up about it puts you in a spiral of self-hate that will eat away at your willpower until it feels like you don't even care about the consequences. Don't get to that stage. Scream at someone, and it'll keep you sane, and remind you that you aren't alone and that you can beat it.
Good luck man.
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suboxone is a good friend for this type of things. luckily hydrocodone is a fairly weak opiate. you can ride this out!
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Definitely don't even think about quitting smoking for the time being.
I've quit morphine a few times (mostly to clean out my tolerance and to remind myself that I actually could survive without it, never attempted it for keeps) and the biggest issue that is going to come up for you in the next few days and weeks is not knowing what to do with yourself. I always got real fidgety and having a cigarette in my hand always helped to deal with that. If you are sitting around and tapping your feet and wiggling your fingers then light up. At least it gives you something to focus on.
You're also going to have a lot more energy than you are used to, which makes it feel like you have ADD or something. People say exercise is the best way to deal with that, although it can be hard to find a continuous period to exercise in if your life is busy.
Failing that, try to really dive into things that you know will tire you out. You said you have kids, so I'm sure that they will be happy to keep you busy for just as long as you can keep up with them. Same goes for your other half, really DO stuff. Throw yourself into your relationship like you were a teenager. Go places, do things, talk all night long. Keep your mind and body active and don't give yourself the chance to be stuck doing nothing. When I was driving, I started singing in the car, which also really helped. It took me from chain smoking and swearing at the guy in front of me to just driving normally. If you get trains or buses, take sudoku or something active to do to keep your fingers busy.
Chances are you won't be able to easily sleep sometimes for the next couple of weeks at least, no matter how tired you feel. If you feel ok about having drugs in the house, then Valium or similar benxos will be a real friend here and stop you turning into a zombie. I found a couple of times after I had got into a pattern of staying busy all day, if I couldn't sleep for one or two nights that I wouldn't be able to do anything the next day and suddenly instead of doing all the good stuff to keep me active all I could do was mope around and feel like my whole life had failed. So anything you can do that will help you sleep would be helpful. If you can't trust yourself, suggest that your wife keeps hold of the pills. Even if she doesn't know about your opiate addiction, she must know that you haven't been sleeping, and its easy enough to say 'I need to sleep, but it so easy to depend on them' and she'll probably help you out.
Above all, stay strong. Make a card with the reasons that you quit on it and carry it everywhere. If ever you are tempted to use, get it out and really think about those reasons. You know why you quit, you know why you don't want to use, and now you're over the hump you can beat back the cravings by reminding yourself why you went through that hell. It's a mantra to keep away the evil spirits, and if you're anything like me you'll have days where you'll spend half the time repeating it over and over. I always found it to be a comfort. Any reasons that were strong enough for you to go through what you did without breaking will be strong enough to take you forward from now.
And of course, talk about it. Even just typing here helps. Giving form to what you are feeling pushes it out of your brain. A problem shared is a problem halved, and thats so true for drug cravings. Most importantly, whoever you talk to is going to tell you that its ok to feel like drugs mean more to you than your wife or kids. Because sometimes it really does feel like that, but beating yourself up about it puts you in a spiral of self-hate that will eat away at your willpower until it feels like you don't even care about the consequences. Don't get to that stage. Scream at someone, and it'll keep you sane, and remind you that you aren't alone and that you can beat it.
Good luck man.
quitting smoking is definitely on hold :-)
i honestly do not crave the pills one bit, i do miss the energy they gave me though. the worse part about this withdrawal is the lack of sleep and the extreme fatigue i'm feeling every morning. today was bad, though i woke up and went swimming, had breakfast, then went to work, it took me till around 11am till i could feel any energy in my mind and body. I REALLY HOPE IT'S JUST PART OF THE WITHDRAWAL!!! i talked to a guy at work who's into body building and hard core exercising and he gave me some advice on kinds of food to eat to get more energy, so tomorrow it's whole wheat toasts, eggs, peanut butter, and milk for breakfast! i also swam some more this evening so i'll skip that tomorrow morning i think; part of my fatigue this morning was the swimming in the AM i think...
the only real reason i quit this shit is because i realized i didn't feel normal without the pills, and that was a sign of a problem to me... i remember days in not so distant past where i had all the energy in the world, without the damn pills! that's where i want to get back to. recently it was no pills = feel like shit, pills = feel normal. i want to feel normal and energetic without them, and then perhaps i'll resume taking them IF I NEED THEM for my back pain (2 herniated disks, L4-L5, L5-S1, so I do have a valid reason to take them on occasion). BUT, i've decided to whip myself into shape and exercise more, and control my back pain this way, i'm 32-yo for crying out loud! Opiates in my future will be an exception, once in a while thing, not an every day must have! i know how it sounds, but in all honesty i know that there will be time in the future where i'll pop a pill and enjoy it, i just want to get back to the way it used to be in the past, when pills were once in a while thing for me! i guess it was just too easy with all the docs willing to write scripts left and right. lesson learned, i will do all i can to not make it a habit ever again! or so I hope :-)
let me end with this one last super important question: WILL THE FATIGUE AND LACK OF ENERGY GO AWAY?!?!?!?!? i know it's only been a week, i know i have to be patient! but shit! it's sometimes hard to breath, much less walk to a crapper, or work! Please tell me this will get better soon!!!
R.L.
EDIT TO ADD: I notice that the Fatigue goes away toward the end of the day... could it be because I ALWAYS took pills in the morning???
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yah man, for sure it will go away eventually. Could be another couple weeks before you get there, but as long as you stick to your goal, the day will come. Then you will realize why you decided to get clean in the first place. So keep grinding away man, and before long you will be enjoying the fruits of your labor! again....good luck!! :) :) :)
train4twenty
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yah man, for sure it will go away eventually. Could be another couple weeks before you get there, but as long as you stick to your goal, the day will come. Then you will realize why you decided to get clean in the first place. So keep grinding away man, and before long you will be enjoying the fruits of your labor! again....good luck!! :) :) :)
train4twenty
Thanks! That's why I love this forum! It's the only place where I can come, share my most intimate secrets about my pills problem and I'll be greeted with advice and support rather than judgmental and condescending attitude! Thank You All for your kind words and helpful advice!
Now let's see if Unisom, red wine, and melatonin pills go well together...
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Look, I don't know much about opiates, but I do know about hallucinogens and cannabis. Research suggests that acid has great success in alcohol withdrawal and pain relief... While it does not make the pain go away, it makes you care about it less...
I suggest you try taking LSD and smoking cannabis for relief (for the duration of the detox). I don't know how effective something like that would be, but there's no harm in trying... Worst case you get addicted to cannabis which is not a big deal, and much better than being addicted to opiates (for various reasons).
Keep in mind that theoretically opiates don't cause health risks if they are taken in moderation, and are pure. However, there is a great risk for addiction (as you have discovered), and it's pretty easy to OD, and tolerance builds up quickly... All of those combined make opiates problematic.
Jesus! LSD on an opiate withdrawl!!! Sorry, but you evidently don't know much about opiates or acid for that matter! I cannot imagine a worse scenario to trip in. However, cannabis does definitely help me with withdrawl. The stronger, the better- it takes your mind away and relaxes those aching limbs.
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However, cannabis does definitely help me with withdrawl. The stronger, the better- it takes your mind away and relaxes those aching limbs.
Agreed. The aches are the real son-of-a-bitch. The runny nose and, well... runny everything... is craptacular but not so bad that you couldn't deal with it. For me, the killer was the aches. Going from being a happy go lucky regular young guy to feeling like I had arthritis was just murder. Couldn't go up and down stairs, couldn't pick things up, couldn't bend down to the floor. Even sitting doing nothing I could just feel my joints THROB. In fact, that was much more why I couldn't sleep. I can even sleep with hot and cold flushes just about, even though it ends up being very disturbed sleep. Laying in bed trying to sleep when it feels like theres a vice crushing my knees... Just thinking about it makes me shudder. Cannabis really can help with that.
But not LSD. Dear god no. Thats a TERRIBLE idea. Unless you're keen to experience a psychotic break or something.
Also, for what its worth I've heard that DXM (the stuff from cough syrup that is also a hallucinogenic in large doses) can be helpful with opiate withdraw. Never tested it myself, primarily because its straight up impossible to get the stuff legally here, and not enough interest for there to be a black market. Anyways, I've read that in a few places that I generally find to be trustworthy that it can help push the DT symptoms back. Soooo if anyone else is quitting and DXM is available where they are, then I'd say give that a shot. And maybe smoke a joint or two.
I definitely wouldn't recommend drinking while DTing btw. Drugs do lots of cool things, but booze is the one that will make scoring and getting really high seem not only to be a good idea, but the only idea.
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Look, I don't know much about opiates, but I do know about hallucinogens and cannabis. Research suggests that acid has great success in alcohol withdrawal and pain relief... While it does not make the pain go away, it makes you care about it less...
I suggest you try taking LSD and smoking cannabis for relief (for the duration of the detox). I don't know how effective something like that would be, but there's no harm in trying... Worst case you get addicted to cannabis which is not a big deal, and much better than being addicted to opiates (for various reasons).
Keep in mind that theoretically opiates don't cause health risks if they are taken in moderation, and are pure. However, there is a great risk for addiction (as you have discovered), and it's pretty easy to OD, and tolerance builds up quickly... All of those combined make opiates problematic.
What is this shitty advice man?? Combat opioid withdrawal with LSD?! His set is going be god awful, besides inviting a whole new set of problems such as LSD-enhanced-shittiest-feeling-ever this advice is purely speculative/wishful thinking. The only thing that would possiibly help is ibogaine, but enough of that.
In experience a step-down methadone program gives better long term abstinence in patients, otherwise symptomatic management with 10mg Diazepam once daily should help you through, the Soma also should do the trick. But be easy on them; ironically Benzos are a far more dangerous drug than opioids, dont get too accustomed to them.
Congrats for taking the step to quit, respect!
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Tapering is definitely the way forward I would agree. But, methadone is almost certainly not the way forward from HC withdrawl. Methadone is some potent shit in its own right, and has a really long half-life (it takes WEEKS to clear your system) while HC is relatively low-powered by comparison. If you talk to anyone about getting on a methadone taper they'll assume you've been using H and set it up accordingly. I don't even know if you could functionally set up a methadone taper weak enough to target HC withdrawl.
Even for H users, methadone has its problems, the biggest being that it locks you in to months of tapering, because you have to taper off the methadone too.
I've never been an H user, but have been an morphine user/addict/baby-junkie for over two years now, and tapering has never been difficult to set up. Start off with enough of a dose to give you no DTs that day but not get high, then drop it off by a quarter every 2-3 days, taking it as late in the day as you can manage to. I've tapered to nothing in a week that way, and had a way better time than just quitting. It normally meant that I looked like I had the flu for the last few days (runny nose and sniffles) but nothing worse, then a couple of bad days when I was down to zero that I countered with benzos, weed and primal scream therapy (screaming releases endorphins). Wake up after tenish days and you should be cool without having gone through serious proper withdrawl. Got some pretty fucked up nightmares that way, but I was never disabled by DTs.
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Bear in mind there is no such thing as a 'weak or strong' opiate; 300mg of codeine is equal to 30mg morphine and 7.5mg Heroin, addiction to Hydrocodone is just as much an indication for methadone as heroin addiction.
what are the problems you speak of? opioids mainly have the problems of constipation, nausea, itch and poor sleep quality. The fact it stays in your system for up to 12 days is a good thing; it means you have less cravings.
Also by DTs do you mean delirium tremens? this is part of the alcohol/benzodiazepine withdrawal sequalae, not opioid withdrawl.
How are you getting on OP?
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Bear in mind there is no such thing as a 'weak or strong' opiate; 300mg of codeine is equal to 30mg morphine and 7.5mg Heroin, addiction to Hydrocodone is just as much an indication for methadone as heroin addiction.
what are the problems you speak of? opioids mainly have the problems of constipation, nausea, itch and poor sleep quality. The fact it stays in your system for up to 12 days is a good thing; it means you have less cravings.
Also by DTs do you mean delirium tremens? this is part of the alcohol/benzodiazepine withdrawal sequalae, not opioid withdrawl.
How are you getting on OP?
Last 3 days were better though I haven't slept all that well last night. Still some fatigue in the mornings but I'm combating it with high energy breakfasts and exercising every day... been swimming in my pool every day at least once per day, for about 15-20 minutes at a time and that get's my heart racing and feels goooooooood!
I'm really hoping to sleep well tonight, and can't wait for the damn morning (when I always took my pills) fatigue to go away... I guess my body is still expecting it's fix in the mornings and is reacting by letting me know through fatigue that it's time :-) Also, last 2 days I've had mad farts and watery shits :-/ my asshole was bleeding from all the wiping it had to endure today at work... I know, not a pretty picture but it's the darn truth!
Two nights ago I slept very well after I took some Unisom, red wine, and Melatonin (spelling?), so I'm doing the same tonight; I'm on my 3rd or 4th glass of Cabernet Sauvignon and just popped 2 Unisoms. Will hit some Melatonin pills when I'm ready for bed... will update tomorrow...
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Look, I don't know much about opiates, but I do know about hallucinogens and cannabis. Research suggests that acid has great success in alcohol withdrawal and pain relief... While it does not make the pain go away, it makes you care about it less...
I suggest you try taking LSD and smoking cannabis for relief (for the duration of the detox). I don't know how effective something like that would be, but there's no harm in trying... Worst case you get addicted to cannabis which is not a big deal, and much better than being addicted to opiates (for various reasons).
Keep in mind that theoretically opiates don't cause health risks if they are taken in moderation, and are pure. However, there is a great risk for addiction (as you have discovered), and it's pretty easy to OD, and tolerance builds up quickly... All of those combined make opiates problematic.
What is this shitty advice man?? Combat opioid withdrawal with LSD?! His set is going be god awful, besides inviting a whole new set of problems such as LSD-enhanced-shittiest-feeling-ever this advice is purely speculative/wishful thinking. The only thing that would possiibly help is ibogaine, but enough of that.
In experience a step-down methadone program gives better long term abstinence in patients, otherwise symptomatic management with 10mg Diazepam once daily should help you through, the Soma also should do the trick. But be easy on them; ironically Benzos are a far more dangerous drug than opioids, dont get too accustomed to them.
Congrats for taking the step to quit, respect!
Some people on these forums try to prescribe acid for like everything man.
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Also, for what its worth I've heard that DXM (the stuff from cough syrup that is also a hallucinogenic in large doses) can be helpful with opiate withdraw. Never tested it myself, primarily because its straight up impossible to get the stuff legally here, and not enough interest for there to be a black market. Anyways, I've read that in a few places that I generally find to be trustworthy that it can help push the DT symptoms back. Soooo if anyone else is quitting and DXM is available where they are, then I'd say give that a shot. And maybe smoke a joint or two.
I know DXM is useful for slowing the development of one's opiate tolerance. Not sure about its use for withdrawals, but you may be onto something.
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Look, I don't know much about opiates, but I do know about hallucinogens and cannabis. Research suggests that acid has great success in alcohol withdrawal and pain relief... While it does not make the pain go away, it makes you care about it less...
I suggest you try taking LSD and smoking cannabis for relief (for the duration of the detox). I don't know how effective something like that would be, but there's no harm in trying... Worst case you get addicted to cannabis which is not a big deal, and much better than being addicted to opiates (for various reasons).
Keep in mind that theoretically opiates don't cause health risks if they are taken in moderation, and are pure. However, there is a great risk for addiction (as you have discovered), and it's pretty easy to OD, and tolerance builds up quickly... All of those combined make opiates problematic.
most retarded advice ever...
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Look, I don't know much about opiates, but I do know about hallucinogens and cannabis. Research suggests that acid has great success in alcohol withdrawal and pain relief... While it does not make the pain go away, it makes you care about it less...
I suggest you try taking LSD and smoking cannabis for relief (for the duration of the detox). I don't know how effective something like that would be, but there's no harm in trying... Worst case you get addicted to cannabis which is not a big deal, and much better than being addicted to opiates (for various reasons).
Keep in mind that theoretically opiates don't cause health risks if they are taken in moderation, and are pure. However, there is a great risk for addiction (as you have discovered), and it's pretty easy to OD, and tolerance builds up quickly... All of those combined make opiates problematic.
most retarded advice ever...
Yeah that post does not even need to exist and is most definitely not Drug Safety quality knowledge.
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+1 for the two of you
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You're probably through the worst of it now so the wine and unisom for sleep is all you need. You are mainly going to have to fight the psychological battle now. But from the sounds of it you can do that. If you have been able to do it while the physical symptoms were so bad you can easily do it when those symptoms subside. You will start to notice things that were numb before. When i quit i noticed the sun shine for the first time in weeks. I noticed the sound of a creek behind my house. I noticed the little pleasures my kids had to often that i was numb to before. Hold onto those things and you'll glide through the downhill side of this battle.
You've done it! Congrats!!
For those reading this that haven't beat it yet you should Google Immodium AD for opiate withdrawal. I don't remember where i found it for my fight, but i found it on Google. It was a mixture of Immodium, Zantac(or something similar), tonic water, and grapefruit juice. The combination made sense chemically and it worked great for me. At least it took the screaming shits out of the mix which was a huge help! The worst part of all of it for me was the lack of sleep and the restless leg syndrome. Cold Turkey is hard core and very difficult. It won't work for most so i would strongly advise finding a mixture like this to help. Tapering of sorts, but i could never taper. If i had the one pill left and hit a peak of feeling like shit that one pill would be history for the temporary relief. Kudos to you on your cold turkey approach. That's what i did with morphine and it was brutal, but at the 9 or 10 day mark you are just about totally out of the physical woods. Remember the pain and enjoy your kids and you will conquer the psychological part too. Best of Luck!
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For those reading this that haven't beat it yet you should Google Immodium AD for opiate withdrawal. I don't remember where i found it for my fight, but i found it on Google. It was a mixture of Immodium, Zantac(or something similar), tonic water, and grapefruit juice. The combination made sense chemically and it worked great for me.
Yeah, Immodium is an opioid that doesn't cross the blood-brain-barrier, thus largely sticking to the intestines (no pun intended). It's definitely worth taking because not only are the shits uncomfortable, but they dehydrate you and make it difficult to absorb the nutrition you need to help overcome the addiction. Immodium will clear that up in all but the worst cases.
The GFJ, tonic water, and Zantac (Tagament?) are all opioid potentiators that inhibit a couple of liver enzymes, keeping more active metabolites of the drug in your system longer. Not sure if they influence the concentration of those metabolites weeks after you quit--unless maybe it was an opioid with a long half life such as methadone--but it doesn't hurt to try.
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Tapering is definitely the way forward I would agree. But, methadone is almost certainly not the way forward from HC withdrawl. Methadone is some potent shit in its own right, and has a really long half-life (it takes WEEKS to clear your system) while HC is relatively low-powered by comparison. If you talk to anyone about getting on a methadone taper they'll assume you've been using H and set it up accordingly. I don't even know if you could functionally set up a methadone taper weak enough to target HC withdrawl.
yeah i wouldn't recommend methadone either for hydrocodone. Especially if its a relatively small dose. I'm on 65mgs of methadone a day, and i think its harder to shake than H. Though, methadone isn't only for heroin users. Pill addiction can be treated with methadone maintenance, but if you go in with less than an 80/mg a day oxy habit, youll probably be told to try something else....For the OP to get on methadone, he would just be getting himself into more trouble. you definitely made the right choice going the cold turkey route!
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Tapering is definitely the way forward I would agree. But, methadone is almost certainly not the way forward from HC withdrawl. Methadone is some potent shit in its own right, and has a really long half-life (it takes WEEKS to clear your system) while HC is relatively low-powered by comparison. If you talk to anyone about getting on a methadone taper they'll assume you've been using H and set it up accordingly. I don't even know if you could functionally set up a methadone taper weak enough to target HC withdrawl.
yeah i wouldn't recommend methadone either for hydrocodone. Especially if its a relatively small dose. I'm on 65mgs of methadone a day, and i think its harder to shake than H. Though, methadone isn't only for heroin users. Pill addiction can be treated with methadone maintenance, but if you go in with less than an 80/mg a day oxy habit, youll probably be told to try something else....For the OP to get on methadone, he would just be getting himself into more trouble. you definitely made the right choice going the cold turkey route!
++++++++++++1 on this comment!!
A real story :
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I have a friend and we know each other from kindergarten. He had a younger brother and so did i, so they also where in a group off friends. So i go play at his house and visa vera. So my parents get to know their parents and they also became very very good friends off us, until this day! The problem was that he and his younger brother (know there is again a younger brother they have from 11y or so) were living in a rich neighbourhood. All doctors, laywers, officer from the army, dentisi, etc...and we lived in a social neibourhood and i grew up smoking sigarets when i was 10-11y and some even 8-9y old (no joke!) . Then when i was 13 i had my first weed experience and als during that age...speed! Using speed when going to school and smoking weed and drinking energy drinks (i hate coffee >:( ! ). Well i was 13 so yes childish acting, but from i was 14y i tried many dope : shrooms, xtc, ghb, speed, cocaine, weed, hash, cannabis cake and cookies, alcohol, sigarets, mushroom-chocolate bars = YEP REALLY CRAZY. PEOPLE FROM NL AND BE AND MAYBE OTHER WESTERN EU COUNTRIES WILL REMEMBER MORE THEN 12Y AGO THERE WAS A TIME THERE WERE CHOCOLATE BARS ON THE MARKET WITH MUSHROOM INSIDE IT!! AND THE PACKAGE ON THE OUTSIDE HAD A LITTLE PERSON RIGHT OR LEFT IN THE CORNOR AND YOU SAW A CLEAR NIGHT WITH STARS ON IT...THAT WAS THE PAPER WERE IT WAS WRAPPED IN, THE PACKAGING. WE CALLED IT IN DUCTH " SHAPMI - CHOCOLATE" :D. .......I wonder if they still exist because really it was a normal chocolate bar when you saw it and there where 4 not so deep cuts in it, so then the bar had a look off 4 scares on top off the chocolate bars so that means 4 doses! But i am going Off Topic here :D.....
So then when i was still 14y we were with many kids (friends) who all lived in the some social neibourhood where cops drove by min 2 times a day. And most off my friends had older brothers and some sisters, and wel liked to go playing on the Nintendo 8) (oldskool ;D) and smoke weed and do speed and cocke combined and sometimes some cans off beer. I know i am not proud off this that is why i said "the story :"!
Off course when we got inside the older ones where sitting there in the living, with tin foil and a lighter and a tube in their mouth made out off tin foil, we did not pay much attention and just saiid hello quick to everybody (the older brothers and sisters from my friends) and we always go upstairs in my friends room where the tv and the nintendo was and then we smoked or snorted. But then when i was 16y we all knew that the older ones were junkies, we knew what H was and saw it when some off us where only 9y old!! And when i was 16 and most off them where 17 or 20 and 3 where younger then me, the youngest was 14y old when i was 16y...and then we all tried smoking H, including the 14y old!! 1 was somebody that could burn very good so we each take a turn to smoke 2 rails each time and after we each did like 12 rails we were high as fuck and feeling soooo good and relaxed and hup !! BAM!! 95% off us smoked the other day again! 1 person did not and he was the only one who NEVER EVER DID H AGAIN AFTER THAT 1 TIME AND HE WAS NOT EVEN SICK....NOBODY WAS FEELING SICK!! So then when my friend from school from the richer parents came each week 1 day hanging out with us where i lived, he was a weir guy...good parents with 1 own large shop and travelling the world each time for 2 weeks to make offers and deals in hospitals for a medicine companie, by giving out samples and seminars and then bingo he has always 6 out off 10 contracts from hospitals in countries where he is promoting meds for a big companie (the job his father does). So he came out an area full off big houses and wealthy people's and good behaving kids. And he was a rebelian because he also wants the fun off being a boy and enjoying life and party's 8) :D ;D!!
So about that boy i gonna say something :
He could hide his DAILY H USE for almost 2 years and each day minimum 2 gr smoking on tin foil! His mother caught him on his room because she came back 2 hours earlier because there was was a big fire down in the street from the big shop and was an evacuation because off danger off explosives because there was a gas station next to the burning building!. So he had his music on pretty loud off the tv and was smoking H in his bed watching a movie. And he always locked the room when he was smoking and when he had done he smoked then a sigarette or 2 to try to cover the smell better if someone was home and he smoked in his room. And just this time he forgot to lock his door after he went to take a piss, mother comes home and called to him but tv was loud and she gets upstairs to his room and does his door open. He was sitting there nodding with tin foil in his hand, 2 bags with H on his bed, his tube to smoke lays on his chest and his nose and cheak has all black marks and stripes on it. THIS IS WHAT I HAVE HEARD FROM MY MOM BECAUSE HIS MOTHER IS A FRIEND OF MY MOM.....SO MY MOM TOLD ME!
Off course she was mad and she yanked his tin foil out his hands taked the tube and the bags with H in it, 1full gran! And he was shocked about his mom being so mad that she was crying and he begged his mom to not tell the father if he called from a countrie he was in for his meds promoting. So he said sorry, and he was really shocked ass well because he was 19 and his mom had said that she wanna to call the cops to take him away for a night and the next day to a rehab from almost more as 3y!!
They came to a compromise and he had to stay inside and must go every day in the early morning with his mother to their shop, so that she can get an eye on him. He was the next day sick driving along with his mom and after a couple off hours he could lay down on a couch his mom had in her office at here business, he strated to puking and he slmost was shiiting in his pants and was like someone with a serious flue attack from the worst kind, and she raced to the hospital with him and he got a high dose shot off morfine and some valiums and they said at the hospital that needs to go the same day to a doctor in the city asking for methadone because they told his mom that the shot morfine was a high dose and also the valiums but that after 5 or 6 hours it would start again.
!! NORMALLY HERE IN THE HOSPITALS WHEN THEY BRING A HEROIN JUNKIE INSIDE LIKE COPS SOMETIMES DO TO ASK TO GIVE SOMETHING AGAINST WITHDRAWL...MOST DOCTORS ARE HUGE DICKHEADS THAT SAYS " I GIVE NOTHING ON THAT JUNKIE? OR THEY SAY THEY CAN'T GIVE THE PERSON SOMETHING BECAUSE THEY ARE NOT SPECIALISED AND MOST DICKHEADS WILL SAY ALSO THAT HE OR SHE WILL SURIVIVE THE WITHDRAWLS! I know major dicks in the 2 hospitals here nearby. But my friend was lucky because they lived in an area where also doctors lived and 2 doctors reconized his mother and helped him and then they actually gave good advice to tell to go to a doc in the city for methadone treatment for a short time.
So in the evening he and his mom went to a doctor in the city and had papers by from high ranked docs from the hospitals, so without any questions or testing iff he really is taking H by giving pee. He asked wat he used on a daily base and he said minimu 2,5 to 3grams off very good gear. He was given 60mg a day and from there on to the pharmacy after the methadone. But his mom was not knowing how painful stopping with H is! So every week she went to the doctor and she said every week -10mg, even the doc said it was to fast but yeah she thought after 6 weeks my son will be clean. The 4 last weeks the doc could reason sith his mom to do the last steps in 2.5mg off every week instead off going from 10mg to 0mg, nothing :o ! But he had to go each day with his mother to the shop and stay in her sight. When he was going from 2.5mg to omg from one day on the other, i was conserned because he was goin to suffer again so without his mothers knowledge i drove with my bike at 1 am at night each Saturday( morning) and i got true the garden he opend his window and i trowed always 5gr weed1 25 valiums, and 5 blisters off 2mg alprazolam inside his hands when he stood on hos balcony. He just had to trow money back for the weed and alprazolam because the valiums were from my mother and were laying there, a bunch off them (i started taking first benzo when i was 18, if i had known then 8))
So the benzo's was taking the edges off and he could sleep for max 4 hours the first week. Then after 3 weeks i stopped delevering him benzo's, only 1 time a month max 2 times 5gr weed.
I gonna tell from him what he told me a couple months ago, that scared me actually :
HE IS MORE AS 2Y OFF ANY OPIATE AND IS NOW STOPPING WEED AS WELL. UNTIL THIS DAY HE HAS LIKE 5 TIMES A MONTH SHIVERRINGS...COLD SWEATS....A RUNNY NOSE. THAT IS ALL!
SO HE SAID IT TO ME IT TAKE THAT LONG THAT EVEN NOW HE HAS SOMETIMES LITTLE MOMENTS OFF COLD SWEATS A RUNNY NOSE BUT AS AN EX H ADDICT YOU THINK THAT IS STILL THE LITTLE WITHDRAWL SIGNS. SO RUDE SAID : IT WILL BE A LONG MIND FUCKER AND YOU HAVE TO BE BUSY AS MUCH AS YOU CAN HE SAID TO ME :. GET A JOB ( I HAVE ONE BELIEVE IT OR NOT), GO FIND A SPORT, A NEW GROUP OFF FRIENDS, HE HAS AGAIN A HOT GIRL....
So my point here is :......!! METHADONE IS MUCH WORSE DAN KICKING HEROIN !!
Have a nice day all :)
Greettzz
Ps : I myself am on methadone, benzo's an yes honesty is important...i still chase min 1 or 2 times a week H!!
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Take over the counter store brand Immodium (pricewise of course) along with otc off brand zantac. Loperamide is an opiate, and while it doesnt cross the blood brain barrier, with a little antacid it will metabolize enough to keep you from bad withdrawals. Its good for the loose bowels too.. so its like a twoferwun!!!
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Been over 2 weeks now, and I'm doing great! The morning fatigue is much less annoying now than it was a week ago! I noticed that exercise, sleep, and good breakfasts, as well as vitamins make a big difference. Also, the diarrhea from hell is gone too :-) oh thank God!
Still have my one pill, and frankly it does not bother me ONE BIT that I look at it every day when reaching for vitamins :-) I guess I am one tough mother fucker when it comes to kicking bad habits LOL! but it's just like with smoking and anything else, you have to WANT IT in your head to be successful at it!
Anyways, the only lingering issue is sleep, and I fight it with red wine and melatonin tablets: 1 bottle of wine + 2 melatonin tablets = FUUUUUUUCK you sleep for at least 4-6 hours. I usually hit the sack at 11pm, sometimes earlier, and wake up around 5am, take another melatonin pill, and sleep till 7-8am or till my baby girl wakes me up :-) Another thing I've noticed is that I started to dream again... it's weird, when you stop having dreams you don't notice it I guess, and when they suddenly come back you're like "what the shitz?!?!" Yes, last night a coworker was installing a turbo kit in my Civic and I owed him $1400 and had no way to pay LOL, and nights before that it was a zombie apocalypse, and other crazy shit I dreamed up! One other thing I've noticed is that you notice more shit. I know being on opiates didn't completely numb the mind and turned me into a veggie, but it certainly disabled a lot of idle processing going on in the back of the mind, like oh look wind is blowing, i can hear water flowing over there, or a bird singing, and other ambient shit like that that would other wise come and go completely unnoticed.
Now what I think didn't help with my sleeping issues is that few months ago I was laid off and then started a new job making about 50 fucking K less than I did before, so now I'm on a budget! Shit just timed so bad, I bought a house 5 months ago, then go laid off along with 70% of my company 3 days after making my first mortgage payment, now I bring home 3.5K less a month (after taxes) and it certainly doesn't help with sleep LOL! BUT things are getting better, I'm saving my one LorTab pill for an interview I HOPE TO FUCKING HAVE SOON with a company I hear pays better!!!!!! Opiates for some reason made me a much better programmer and problem solver, so hopefully they will help get a new job! oh yea, and they will certainly be a once in a while thing from now on, or so I hope...
Limbo Out!
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methadone always helped me. just my personal experience.
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OP's quote "One other thing I've noticed is that you notice more shit. I know being on opiates didn't completely numb the mind and turned me into a veggie, but it certainly disabled a lot of idle processing going on in the back of the mind, like oh look wind is blowing, i can hear water flowing over there, or a bird singing, and other ambient shit like that that would other wise come and go completely unnoticed."
My quote a few days ago "When i quit i noticed the sun shine for the first time in weeks. I noticed the sound of a creek behind my house. I noticed the little pleasures my kids had to often that i was numb to before. Hold onto those things and you'll glide through the downhill side of this battle."
That's exactly what i was talking about!!
Good for you and the best of luck with everything!! Your family, house, job, and all. You got this shit!!